YCB's Tank Threat Guide (Itemization and Explanations)

[Monga]

good post, just 2 things to say :

Imp taunt > mandatory for any raids imo. Those 2 seconds save your DPS in MANY situations, specially when your raid is full world buff / is doing 2k dps in average on boss.
So many fights it is needed, and you wont suffer with this talent threat wise (reduce armor in spec and G2G, you don't need armor for threat anyway)
Whatever the spec you choose, imp taunt is mandatory as a good tank.

http://db.vanillagaming.org/?talent#Lbhx0hZcZEfzoxMzVo
Best spec in any situation for max threat.

if not rank 13, stacking world buffs and using lionheart helm is the way to go, definitely.
why the hell not use the bis helm when you already have 10k+ hp ?
Vael helm is shit as hell, even more for horde.

If you are not using full world buffs, then it's another matter, and lionheart is questionable.
But this topic is speaking about threat gear, so raid with full WBuffs

Str: 4th position before stamina / defense / armor whatever.
You don't need def or armor when you are at 10k hp for a speedrun / going for threat gear.

Before breaking r13 gear set, if you are (40 ap wise, it's dank, whatever you say) you have to be able to break it with amazing gear (t2.5 for sure / chroma boots + gladiator chest once updated for example and then use lionheart helm and later T2.5 helm)
Idealy set is helm / chest / shoulders in t2.5 and r12 legs / gloves / chroma boots.

^ This guy knows his shit!

[Aslan]

Why do your threat builds all let out on 2 additional points in cruelty. Makes me question the value of it in low rage situations.

Edit: for osme reason i thought Ixl's spec would already include impale and had leftover points

[Undertanker]

You can only go 3 fury if you are going 17 in arms for Impale. Giving you 31 points remaining for shield slam.


@ the people that are suggesting all this dps gear for tanking:

A tank has 2 jobs. Hold threat, mitigate damage.

Some seems to be focused on one and not the other. This is a TANK threat guide, not DPS while boss is hitting you guide. If your dps are going all out after waiting a reasonable 2 seconds for a global cooldown, and are not pulling aggro, great. But if your top dps are 30% below you on KTM at the end of that fight, you are not doing job #2 of damage mitigation as you have focused too much on job #1.

This is trial and error by any guild until you know your dps limitations based off each boss mechanics. Some bosses, no matter the gear, DPS will not come close as they focus adds or have to LoS at times. Other bosses, mechanics drop your threat or gouge/cc you. Nef, classes are having to stop dps on boss to counter other mechanics. (only a string of pally / warrior calls would ever pose TPS issues) Pure DPS race which this thread is focusing on is not the every boss pull situation as people may act.

Find a balance of gear per fight that brings you over the top dps w/o them having to slow down, but doesn't put you so far ahead that you took unnecessary damage to an extent of stressing healers. Which in turn makes them drink more, which would slow a raid down just as much as dpsing a lil softer to not pull threat on a pure tank setup would have.

You need to find a balance that doesn't sacrifice too much of any stat, be it stam, armor, def. You can get 6 hit while wearing 8/8 T2, from Don ring, Band of accura, DFT and Saytr bow. You would still be over 6k unbuffed hp and 125ish def if using Def armor kits. For 8 hit, or if DFT is out of reach, you can break 8/8 T2 and use T1 gloves and Bracer of Truflight.

This Lionheart BS with no Def or stam is going too far. It is a bad place to try to get hit/crit, as T2 has 400 more HP and 11 def is around 1.3% avoidance before enchants. And has 10 SR.

A T2 bracer only has stam, and a truflight bracer is a much better trade off. Same with T1 gloves over T2, loss of 5 stam and 2 def (should have def armor kit on here). Its an exchange of avoidance for hit, which I find equal when you can go for hit rings / trinket that do not have as much stam per def that your normal gear slots may have.

@ the IMP Taunt live and die by - guy, more and more bosses as you progress are immune. As the MT, which TPS conversations are for, I'm not taunting off myself. There are off-tanks that will be doing the majority of the taunting, and if DPS pull, it's because there is only one thing to kill, multi target, dps is usually split more for mechanics. There should be an offtank that can taunt. If it resist, mocking block or challenging shout are available.

Only 1 fight at the moment really benefits from IMP taunt, which is Ebonroc. As if you resist or the person that has debuff pulls again, you need taunt up if mocking blow was already used or challenging shout was.

One major subject people forget here, it's DPS job to manage their threat and then do damage. Our job is to manage threat and reduce damage taken. It's a give and take and ignorance from one side or the other disrupts this balance.


TL;DR: Imp Taunt is better for an OT. Can't get 5/5 cruelty because you don't have 53 points. Lionheart helm is gimping yourself too much, get hit elsewhere. Balance gear for hit and def. Finish a fight close to dps KTM meter, if you are super far ahead, take off hit gear for tank gear.

[Amkô]

Weapon Choice

If you currently have aggro, and you are rage capped, use a fast weapon (1.3 Speed). This will allow you to spam heroic strike.

If you do not currently have aggro but you are trying to build threat, or you have aggro but the mob does not give you enough rage to allow for heroic strike spam, use a slow hard hitting weapon. This will give you more rage to work with.

So I could use Deathbringer at start (dont have any other slow weapon, even imo it's too slow for tanking) and then switch to my Skinner (when Rage capped) to dump my rage with heroic strikes?

Or just use the timeworn mace (prince DM W) as fury warrior, who is tanking here and there? ^^

[Imbaslap]

just give payo a TF already.(he dezurfs it)


also, toughness is crap if you've done the math.
check your defense level(near cap or over) and start dropping some anticipation for other abilities in prot tree (like the stun resist/MC resist talent) I dunno about you but with AQ around the corner, MC resist will be very handy. also stun resist rocks on those bwl wyrmguards. (can't imagine how broken it would be on a orc tank)

giving a DFT to a tank is the dumbest thing I've ever heard of. get a styleens for more threat gain (herpderp shield block value makes shield slam hit harder what??). I also heard that strength increases damage/block value as well? wait... that is more threat!! and more DAMAGE REDUCTION!

also lifegiving gem comes in very handy as well for tanking scenarios.
Band of Accuria I can see though since it gives crit/dodge/stam/hit.

the thing about impale build is, the more crits you do results in more rage & damage which results in more threat.
Damage is the only thing that scales with gear/stats to increase your threat in tanking. every damage dealing warrior tanking ability has a static additive of threat that comes after your damage. (defiance scales well with both, but again the static threat additives for each ability).

if you want more threat, start doing more damage.
if you want more rage, start getting more crits in.

do not rely on TAKING damage to get rage for threat generation. I see this mistake too much from many guilds streaming there BWL runs and I sadly enjoy watching their tanks get 2 shot by a draketalon wyrmguard because they want to go full TPS and ignore the basics of tanking. /failfish.( I cannot imagine the feelings of your healers about you if you think this is the most ideal way of doing TPS).
if it's corehounds in MC, go ahead and strip naked as they do 0 damage anyway.

if warlocks pull threat, sit them down and slap them around a few times. #problem solved

horde and alliance have different tanking supports/drawbacks. learn them.
find the benefit of WF totem in tank group over agi totem(totem twist if your shaman is gud). also find the benefit of using slower weapons like crul over alcors with WF totem and compare. (trial and error again)

consider blessing of kings/salvation a part of your raid. why do I see alliance tanks wearing this crap http://realmplayers.com/CharacterViewer.aspx?realm=NRB&player=Squibbi is beyond me. Agi scales with BoK, stam scales with BoK, str scales with BoK. start looking at raw stats as more appealing over % numbers. you're also alliance with salvation, stop going tryhard TPS. if you're having such TPS issues in your raid with a TF, you may want to rethink how you play this game. /failfish

trial and error is the best way to figure it out.
or joining a good guild works too.

[Ixl]

TL;DR: Imp Taunt is better for an OT. Can't get 5/5 cruelty because you don't have 53 points. Lionheart helm is gimping yourself too much, get hit elsewhere. Balance gear for hit and def. Finish a fight close to dps KTM meter, if you are super far ahead, take off hit gear for tank gear.

(To Aslan) I did a mistake in the link of my spec, but what I said sums it up and seems logical, just keep 2 tactical for mocking blow on finisher (logical again).
http://rpgworld.altervista.org/classic_ ... 0500201051

To respond to ur shit Undertanker I will simply say :
More threat = more raid DPS = more push = hue nice, something to heal at least ! = faster run = hype. Period.

Imp taunt, I wont argue, in MC bwl it's always nice to have for the same reason stated :
Good tanks = Taunt rotations = Rapid reactions = faster runs = no DPS lost = hype. Period.

Always consider threat gear is situationaly, it's always nice to use itemrack or whatever ur addonto skip gear.
getting 4 hit on an average def gear for example, an other bind for full threat gear etc..

About the Dft on a tank, tbh it's a waste until all melees have it, so I agree even if it's badass on tps, imo better get onslaught girdle, accuria, t1 gloves for a solid start on TPS gear. (DMN rings are nice also, I still use it)
TF + DFT ? I would only say #CLC, a big waste considering it's impossible all melees ATM in his guild has dft.

[snowtime]

Weapon (If you DON’T have Aggro): Crul’Shorukh (Nefarian) >>> Dooms Edge (BWL Trash)

You forgot TF, the proc would in insane in low rage situations. I guess it's kinda obvious though.
Also, how much threat does gift of arthas give per proc?

Anyway thanks for the guide. There's a few T2.5 pieces which will be really nice for threat where you don't have to sacrifice too much.

[Undertanker]

Yes I know more threat = more dps.

What you might have missed was me stating that once you get a feel for what your top dps can push on a tank and spank fight where they can go all out, look at KTM.

Were they close to you in threat? If you are FAR ahead on the meter, then you should then alter your gear for more tank and less TPS.

Were they having to let up? Go for more hit with the least amount of stam/def loss as possible.

I also stated this is by trial and error and diff with each guild.

The items listed in OP were correct, however it should be stated that the items are not intended to be worn all at once for a MT standpoint. It is about balance.

[Undertanker]

I'm also aware that DFT shouldn't be taken from a physical damage class this early in gearing.

However, that being said, once people have their AQ gear and start obtaining Naxx gear items, they get huge increases in damage (threat) and a DFT would be something to pursue at that time.

In AQ 5/5 BiS set, you can't use DFT as you need Styleens + Onxyia Trinket to keep close or at DEF cap. Your added threat comes from the agil/str on T2.5 gear, but at the cost of stam/def compared to T2.