+3 Defense to use Bulwark/Lifegiving

[Undertanker]

As more and more guild progress BWL, tanks find themselves with availability to two popular tanking items:

Elementium Reinforced Bulwark
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19349

and

Lifegiving Gem
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19341

This causes you two lose 16 DEF if you are taking off Draconic Deflector and Onxyia Blood Talisman.

To counter this, we turn towards the +3 DEF availability we have for enchantment / armor kit.

On gloves and boots I have put on +3def. I have recently changed from +9 stamina on T2 bracer and put +3 def as well. (if you think this is too much of a lose, if you are wearing hardened stone band or ring of binding, you could now take it off for a stamina item and come out for more HP)

Between those three items I get 9 DEF back. I am currently using deathbone chest with 100 hp, but when I get T2 chest, I will also but +3 def on it.

This allows you to use the best armored tanking shield available, and a great on use trinket which can give you 15k HP if used with last stand, on use alone to counter an extra Chromag breath or a Nef warrior class call.

Until ZG head/leg enchants are gotten, I see the extra 12 def as > 260 HP and 7 agility.


Either go this route, or use Lifegiving Gem for trash only (5 min CD) and use Onxyia trinket until ZG enchants are obtained on bosses. To be able to still use
Elementium Reinforced Bulwark

Side note***

I am using: Styleen's Impending Scarab for my other trinket.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=19431


Thoughts and feedback.

[Ixl]

[Problem]

The way the server is scripted (tanking wise) is a bit weird...
ZG patch should nerf the entire t1 + BOE / Blue items / some raid items.
T1 should have different amount of def until ZG patch.
Same goes for morris neck, magmadar neck and many items, quest rewards and such...
And I don't even know why they did a nerf on 3/4 items, and not cloak or drac shield.
Cloak should be 7 or shield should be 10...
Example:
http://web.archive.org/web/200507290853 ... ?setid=209
http://web.archive.org/web/200505201602 ... item=18879
Even in BWL :
http://web.archive.org/web/200801060924 ... item=19383
ZG enchants are here to help the nerf, but nerf should came the same moment, not before, or not the half before :/

[/Problem]

Well right now, imo, just don't care that much on def (just for nef regarding class call, glad chest or deathbone, boe shoulders and it's good)
3 def on chest would be to much meh, after calculation, with 3x3 def and full t2 MC ring+ DM cloak Nef neck, you have 422 def, it's enough for 95% of the content.

[Undertanker]

Well I am am concerned with the 5%.

Deathbone with 100hp chest is 22 stam 17 def.

T2 chest with 3 def is 40 stam 14 def.

Nef class call creates an issue that is currently only solves with swapping to Quel after well established aggro due to the need of using Onxyis cloak. With cloak on using styleens/lifegiving I am 427 def, Quel takes me to 440 on the proc.

Mind you I am still using deathbone and deflector.


In regards to the partical nerf, I believe due to the lack of evidence of when those last few blues were nerfed is why they haven't gotten the hatchet yet. When ZG drops we can all expect those last items to get hit and then it is just a rep race. But this thread is focused on before those are available.

[Ixl]

tbh with you, I use 433 def on nef with alcor, and swap ardent custodian for the cap during war class call.
Q's is an RNG weap, I can't trust enough on this for a short "fight" like a class call.

But ye, you need those 440, I just killed nef tonight and even with the cap, breath 6k8 cleave 2k9 in 1 sec, so I don't imagine with a crit !

Still, 20 def from glad chest + boe shoulders are not really an option to have this cap.
Deathbone is nice, but the gain from glad chest with those 20 def are pretty dank!

For the T2 chest, and for those 5%, don't give a fuck because you will always swap your chest. So fo for +100 I guess.

[vido]

If you're gonna die even without getting crit. Wouldn't stacking 100hp rather than 3def (0.12% crit reduction) be more viable? If you get crit you still might dodge/parry so it's not necessarily a wipe, while if you don't have enough stam in the first place you're gonna wipe a lot more often.

[Heldunder]

tbh with you, I use 433 def on nef with alcor, and swap ardent custodian for the cap during war class call.
Q's is an RNG weap, I can't trust enough on this for a short "fight" like a class call.

But ye, you need those 440, I just killed nef tonight and even with the cap, breath 6k8 cleave 2k9 in 1 sec, so I don't imagine with a crit !

Still, 20 def from glad chest + boe shoulders are not really an option to have this cap.
Deathbone is nice, but the gain from glad chest with those 20 def are pretty dank!

For the T2 chest, and for those 5%, don't give a fuck because you will always swap your chest. So fo for +100 I guess.

glad chest isnt 20 def anymore.

[Whiskra]

It became clear pretty quick when a friend and me started looking at calculating defcap with current BWL gear and available enchants that Lifegiving just wasn't an option unless you wanted to deck yourself out in a ton of blues and thus lose out on so many stats it was hardly worth it.

Here's a copypaste of my notes on what BiS gear for a prot warrior should be in this patch if you aim for defcap with most possible stats (but without Lifegiving), something I'm sure most warriors already figured out long ago:

____________

Helm of Wrath | +11 Defense (+100 HP enchant)
Pauldrons of Wrath | +7 Defense (+5 All Resistances enchant)
Breastplate of Wrath | +11 Defense (+3 Defense enchant if going for 8/8 Wrath, +100 HP if going with Legplates of the Eternal Guardian)
Bracelets of Wrath | (+3 Defense enchant if going for 8/8 Wrath, +9 Stamina if going for Legplates of the Eternal Guardian)
Gauntlets of Wrath | +7 Defense (+3 Defense enchant)
Waistband of Wrath | +7 Defense

Legplates of the Eternal Guardian | +22 Defense (+100 HP enchant)
OR
Legplates of Wrath | +11 Defense (+3 Defense enchant)

Sabatons of Wrath | +7 Defense (+3 Defense enchant)
Heavy Dark Iron Band | +5 Defense
Archimtiros' Ring of Reckoning | +0 Defense (if going for Legplates of the Eternal Guardian)

(if going for 8/8 Wrath)
Ring of Binding | +4 Defense
OR
Drakeclaw Band of Stamina | +4 Defense

Onyxia Blood Talisman | +8 Defense (if going for 8/8 Wrath)
OR
Force of Will | +10 Defense (if going for Legplates of the Eternal Guardian)

Styleen's Impeding Scarab | +13 Defense
Master Dragonslayer's Medallion | +7 Defense
Redoubt Cloak | +10 Defense (+70 Armor enchant or +3 Agility enchant)
Elementium Reinforced Bulwark | +7 Defense (+7 Stamina enchant or 2% Blocking enchant)
Alcor's Sunrazor / Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker | +0 Defense (+15 Agility enchant, Crusader enchant, Lifestealing enchant, +5 damage enchant)
Dragonbreath Hand Cannon | +0 Defense (+7 damage scope or 3% hit scope)


Force of Will + Styleen's and +9 Stamina enchant on Bracer instead of +3 Defense, or
Onyxia Blood Talisman + Styleen's and +3 Defense on Bracer instead of +9 Stamina

____________

(Might take the opportunity here to ask if there is anything wrong with my notes now that I post them here.)

As you can see, you can go for either 7/8 with Legplates of the Eternal Guardian for some more HP, or 8/8 for more avoidance and 8/8 set bonus. The question is simply which choice is better. Both choices end up on exactly +130 defense with the enchants listed accordingly.

When Zul'Gurub comes out it becomes easy, you simply put ZG enchants on Wrath helm and Wrath legs and then enchant Wrath chest with HP and Wrath bracer with stamina and put on Archimtiros' over a +4 defense ring and you reach defcap with more HP and avoidance than the 7/8 option we have in this patch.

Lifegiving is not useless of course, it can definetly save your life, but I don't think it's worth sacrificing defcap on critical fights for something that might save your life.

[vido]

Not using lifegiving is plain dumb. Forget about defcap. The chance of dying from a crit will already be stupidly low while livegiving is retardedly broken compared to a few laughable points of avoidance.

[Undertanker]

Yeah I got T2 chest last night and went for 3def.

I am using 6/8 and T1 belt, stonegrips with 3 def.

Using Styleens and lifegiving I am 138. So when I get T2 belt I will be capped again.

Ofc when Burwark ever drops I will be lower than cap again

To the comment about Quel. Do you even have one? Do you realize the uptime of that weapon proc? I didnt say swap to it during a call. Swap to it afyer well established aggro. If a series of pally calls come early, go bacl to alcorz to get higher threat. But dps should never be close to you due to them having to counter other abilities and class calls.

After the first call, you can swap to Quel with no worries and the proc should be up the majority of the time.

[Grave]

I use these item sets to optimize my gear for situations with Hit Gear/Ony Cloak/Lifegiving Gem.

Note: This is not applicable currently, only with ZG. (Cloak + ring)
Tanking Sets

I don't use +3 Defense enchant on wrist. Just 3x3 Defense Kits.