Threat trinket

[Youfie]

Wow, I read your whole wall of text, and then I was thinking "Okay, this guy is right, but.. why? Why is he just stating the obvious again and again for that long, while what I said is exactly the same he does?".

Then I looked at what I wrote when you quoted me . And indeed, my bad, I didn't want to write that PPM-based procs shouldn't proc "at all" on fast weapon, I just meant less than on a slower weapon, assuming said weapon is used for Specials.

Sorry about that .

So, back to the topic, you say that despite using a fast weapon, the prods of DMC:M are enough to make it a viable trinket threat-wise? Wouldn't have thought so, my money would have been on an HoJ versus DMC:M!

[Noonze]

One thing I should tell you before posting the following, change spec into impale (so named) and then you will have good options on TPS trinkets.

In this spec most effective stats are hit%(until you hit cap of it) and crit% (lets not discuss it deeper, but it's less effective, than hit%, still just a bit). So you can use DFT or 2crit% trinkets, or even Mark of the Chosen, but I would choose 2crit% from these. Because you know, get DFT trinket is just close to impossible in most guilds.

[Theloras]

All of you are overlooking the best +threat trinket out there for any tank in either a single target or AoE fight:

Essence of the Pure Flame
Binds when picked up
Unique
Trinket
Requires Level 60
Equip: When struck in combat inflicts 13 Fire damage to the attacker.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=18815

It's free, unmitigated damage to ANY target that hits you...

[Armilus]

So, back to the topic, you say that despite using a fast weapon, the prods of DMC:M are enough to make it a viable trinket threat-wise? Wouldn't have thought so, my money would have been on an HoJ versus DMC:M!

Assuming that you'll be using a fast weapon when using max threat trinkets, your auto attacks will probably hit for a lot less than DMC:M. Assuming they have similar proc chance (which I think is the case) then you are better off with DMC:M.

Extra attacks from HoJ are subject to dodge, parry and armor on a boss but the DMC:M proc is only reduced by resistance. For DPS they don't have to worry about parry/block with HoJ but the tank will always be in front.

I haven't crunched the numbers on it but I think DMC:M would come out ahead.

As Noonze said, hit is the best stat for threat until you are at 5%, then crit is best. If you have 5% hit without DFT, then Blank Hands Breadth is definitely #1 (because impale and your shield slam can crit). #2 is up for discussion.

Edit:

My ideal max threat set would be DFT/Blackhand's breath with band of accuria and Don Julio's. Rest of your gear can then be pure mitigation/stam. Maybe a few PvP pieces with stam and crit.

[Undertanker]

Can't crit a Sunder. Revenge Crit is shit. This leaves shield slams which is on a CD, and heroic strikes (with alcorz is not too strong) for 2% being weighed. This trinket is overvalued.

DMC:M isn't dependent on only HS or shield slam.

Also for the person that keeps linking essence of pure flame....... single target. Theloras, I stand up for you in your pally tanking speeches, but you are way off on this one. 2.6 speed (thunderclap) enemy and 13 damage. (does not crit)

DMC:M. 200-300 damage, can crit. I tank with about 16% crit atm. so let's take mid damage of the trinket and add 16% crit which impale spec would increase that by 20% crit damage, so 346 damage average per proc. Hey lets add resist of 20% - 292 damage average per proc.


It will take getting hit 22 times from a single mob to equal the average damage of DMC:M. Assume thunderclap is always up. And assuming you always get hit. This is not the case, you factor in change to be missed, and this trinket is even more single target shit.

It will take 58.4 seconds to break even. DMC:M procs way more than once every 58.4 seconds when you have unlimited rage as you would in a TPS situation. So please stop giving bad information. It is purely an AOE trinket you put on once a raid to try hard on a specific pull.

In 5 man situations, spamming cleave, and stance dance to WW, gives this thing even more damage. Nothing sweeter than using a weak revenge, and boom, DMC:M crit 500+. Snap aggro my friend.


Ideally, Band of Accura for Ring 1, and with AQ pair with EMP ring or rep ring. Trinkets, DFT and syteens. That is 4 hit, and get crossbow of imminent doom from AQ20 for 5th hit: http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=21459. This is purely BiS till nax for trinket and rings TPS w/o missing out on DEF at all.

[Youfie]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but DMC:M can crit, but uses your spell crit chance though. The only crit I've ever gotten with it happened while being Onyxia buffed (just like Poisons).

Also, the proc being Magical, I don't see how it could be affected by the Impale Talent.

It's reduced by about 22% by Miss (17%) and Innate Resistances (6%): 0.83*0.94 =0.7802.

Which mean its average damage would be 250 * 0.7802 =195.05 average damage, on a boss without any particular resistance.

DMC:M might be a good trinket anyway, but just to have exact information to rely on .

[Heldunder]

All of you are overlooking the best +threat trinket out there for any tank in either a single target or AoE fight:

Essence of the Pure Flame
Binds when picked up
Unique
Trinket
Requires Level 60
Equip: When struck in combat inflicts 13 Fire damage to the attacker.
http://db.vanillagaming.org/?item=18815

It's free, unmitigated damage to ANY target that hits you...

already recommended this lol

[Armilus]

Can't crit a Sunder. Revenge Crit is shit. This leaves shield slams which is on a CD, and heroic strikes (with alcorz is not too strong) for 2% being weighed. This trinket is overvalued.

For Alcorz, it doesn't matter how hard it hits. What's the difference between 40 attacks in a minute and 10 are crits vs. 20 attacks that hit twice as hard, 5 of which are crits? Nothing, it's the same. So crit has the same effect on a 1.3s dagger as it does on a 2.6s sword. BUT, if you are using heroic strike every swing, it adds 138 damage to every swing and this extra damage IS multiplied by crit. So crit is BETTER for a fast weapon when spamming heroic strike than for a slow weapon because you are getting MORE of the +138 damage from heroic strike in the same time frame.

Anyway, I still don't feel like crunching the numbers

Maybe #1 threat trinket (if you have 5% hit already) is between Blackhand's and DMC:M, in which case they are obviously the top 2 and it doesn't matter at all because you can equip 2 trinkets.

With heroic strike and impale I think a crit will increase your damage by about the same as what you get from a proc so it comes down to proc rate.

[Undertanker]

I think you misunderstood why I said the 2 crit is overvalued some. It is because Sunder can't crit, and revenge crit is very small.

But getting DMC:M proc off a sunder, revenge is super.

But your statement above should wrap this thread up.