Dragonfang blade vs CHT offhand

[Psychicx]

CHT is 12.5% faster than DFB
DFB has 0.4% crit and 4 ap less than cht.

DFB - (top end + low end) / 2 = 99.5 damage
CHT - (top end + low end) / 2 = 82 damage

Add the speed with SnD on (1000 seconds for scale):

DFB 99.5 - 1.38 sec (724.6 hits in 1000 seconds) = 72097,7 damage
CHT 82 - 1.23 sec (813.0 hits in 1000 seconds) = 66666,0 damage

Average instant poison damage per hit is 26 (did not account crit / resist).
813-724.6 = 88.4 more hits than dfb.
88.4 x 26 = 2298.4 > CHT does 2298.4 more poison damage over 1000 hits than DFB.

Let's remember that off hand deals 0.5 base x 0.5 modifier from talents = 0.75

DFB - 72097.7 x 0.75 = 54073.275
CHT - 66666 x 0.75 = 49999.5 -> add poison damage 49999.5 + 2298.4 = 52297.9

52297.9 / 54073.275 = 0.967... > 96.7%

100 % - 96.7% = 3.3%

DFB deals 3.3% more damage including poison damage. I didn't add blade flurry which would make the speed gap even smaller meaning DFB would do more than 3.3% damage compared. ALSO poisons are single target which would mean that when cleaving, DFB would do way more damage.

so 3.3%-5% more off hand damage OR 0.4% crit and 4 ap (boosts main hand + yellows).
Bonus with DFB = 130 hp

Thoughts? + feel free to add the missing factors if you got the info.

[Slicy]

Been wondering about this a lot. In my case I'll just go with the one which will mind dropping first.

However if I had the choice, and including all what have been already said, I would also consider faction as a huge factor. Agi scaling with BoK has to be taken into account.

The fact DFB has agi instead of raw AP + Crit means it's not really +0.4 % crit and +4 AP in favor of CHT.
Let's say you have 350 agi unbuffed, which is easy to get at this stage of the game and seems an accurate average agi value for most rogues.
CHT + BoK : 350 + 35 (bok) = 385 agi + 20 AP (cht) = 405
DFB + BoK : 350 + 16 agi (dfb) = 366 + 36,6 (bok) = 402,6
Now have in mind you are way above 350 agi with consummables & other raid buffs. DFB > CHT on the AP department at the moment.
This will be even more relevant as your total agi unbuffed and buffed starts to get higher as you get upgrades in BWL.
In short : With BoK, stat wise, DFB has a better scaling than CHT and yields more AP right now with standard raid buffs and consummables.

Assuming melee tables work as they should, DFB>CHT stats wise is even more relevant if you're raiding with raid buffs/consumms + Rallying Cry of the Dragonslayer + Songflower and/or Scorpok, as you are crit capped on white swings (close to 50% on white swings when your crit cap is at 41,8% with 12% hit from gear+talents+wskill).
In this situation, getting more AP/raw dps ugprades is more important than getting +0,4% crit from CHT I'd say. Pushing crit chance to get closer to your Backstab crit cap when you're already that high (around 78%) is overkill imo. Your main dps loss in combat are Backstab dodges which you can't get rid of anyways. Better trade less crit chance for harder white swings and specials when crit capped.

Conclusion :
- DFB is more OH dmg than CHT.
- DFB yields same/more AP than CHT if you're Alliance because of BoK. The less than +0,4% crit from CHT is irrelevant fully buffed since you'll want to trade less crit for more AP.
- For Horde, no idea as I'm not sure how Windfury works exactly on Nostalrius. Probably equivalent or depends if you want more OH dps or more yellow/MH dps.

[Roseann]

Core Hound Tooth > Dragonfang Blade

To break some misconceptions from previous posts:

Conclusion :
- DFB is more OH dmg than CHT.
- DFB yields same/more AP than CHT if you're Alliance because of BoK. The less than +0,4% crit from CHT is irrelevant fully buffed since you'll want to trade less crit for more AP.
- For Horde, no idea as I'm not sure how Windfury works exactly on Nostalrius. Probably equivalent or depends if you want more OH dps or more yellow/MH dps.

Those are not accurate.

16 agility with kings is ALWAYS 17.6AP.

If you have 300 agility from other items:

300+30 (Kings) = 330+20 (CHT) = 350 AP for CHT
300+16 (DFB) = 316 + 31.6 (Kings) = 347.6 AP from DFB

2.4 AP difference in favour of CHT.

If you have 1000 agility:

1000+100 (Kings) = 1100+20 (CHT) = 1120 AP for CHT
1000+16 (DFB) = 1016 + 101.6 (Kings) = 1117.6 AP from DFB

2.4 AP difference in favour of CHT.

Also CHT has a 0.4% crit edge with kings (0.45% for horde).


Finally, DO NOT forget to apply those extra bonuses to BOTH MH and OH before comparing.




TL;DR: CHT is better as an offhand.

[Slicy]

I think you didn't understand what I meant with "agi scaling". It wasn't clear so my bad.

If you make the choice to favor 20 AP over 16 agi for every item, you'll surely get way less AP in the end since you'll have way less agi and therefore benefit way less from BoK. It is not about comparing 2 OH weapons as stats stick.
That being said, it all depends if you're raiding fully buffed/consummed or not.

The value of 1 agi is around 1.8-2.00 AP depending on your current gear and your buffs.
I took the 1 agi = 1 AP and then applied BoK to show how the difference is way too small in favor of CHT with just BoK into account. I did precise that with consummables & buffs, it's a whole different story.
With buffs & consummables the AP gain of 1 agi makes DFB a better OH than CHT stats wise (and it's more OH dmg like said before).
At some point you also raid with Spirit of Zandalar which makes stats like agi and str yield even more AP.

With BiS available gear and fully buffed, DFB is even ahead of Perdition's Blade as a MH. Because Perdition's dont give any stats, while using DFB + CHT make DFB do more base damage than Perdition's and will buff up your OH dmg as well.

CHT is a better OH only if you're raiding without full buffs/consummables or you have current BiS gear, raid with fulls buffs/consummables and use DFB as MH.