Retribution Pre-Raid and Raid BiS - Updated for ZG Release

[DrearyYew]

There's no math behind the DPS that intellect gives you

[smilkovpetko]

There's no math behind the DPS that intellect gives you

and what is the math behind the DPS that agility gives you ?

[DrearyYew]

19.5 AGI = 1% Crit

Crits multiply damage by 1.50 for Paladin

Crits also proc Vengeance, a 15% Holy and Physical Damage done buff

SoR and Consecrate cannot crit

If you want to see the hard numbers behind it, you can see my post here

Now, if you could please prove how intellect provides DPS, I would love to see it. However, since I know that's not how the game works, I know you won't be able to provide such proof.

[smilkovpetko]

19.5 AGI = 1% Crit

Crits multiply damage by 1.50 for Paladin

Crits also proc Vengeance, a 15% Holy and Physical Damage done buff

SoR and Consecrate cannot crit

If you want to see the hard numbers behind it, you can see my post here

Now, if you could please prove how intellect provides DPS, I would love to see it. However, since I know that's not how the game works, I know you won't be able to provide such proof.

Your proof about Agility are like :

Crits multiply damage by 1.50 for Paladin

Intellect allow you to spam more abilities

Crits also proc Vengeance, a 15% Holy and Physical Damage done buff

Spamming more abilities thanks to Intellect make you proc Vengeance, a 15% Holy and Physical Damage done buff

SoR and Consecrate cannot crit

You can't cast spells if you don't have mana , with more Intellect you cast more spells

If you want to see the hard numbers behind it, you can see my post here

If you want to see the hard numbers behind it, you can see my post viewtopic.php?f=43&t=6548&start=60#p202206

Now, if you could please prove how intellect provides DPS, I would love to see it. However, since I know that's not how the game works, I know you won't be able to provide such proof.

Now you have proof how much Intellect provides DPS based on the same theory as you gave. Since you know how the game works .

And yeah now the stats you posted on your link :

DrearyYew wrote:
Seal of Command Proc: 18.998% AP, 20% SP

Wowwiki and every other source :

http://wowwiki.wikia.com/wiki/Seal_of_C ... did=249861

14 AP = 1 damage

Now

http://realmplayers.com/RaidStats/Fight ... ssLimit=Pa

People with DrearyYew gear = 300 dps

People with Intellect gear = 600 dps

[DrearyYew]

Again, your post has no math, it just says "35 Int gives 48 DPS to Consecration". Consecration doesn't scale with Int, so where is this increase in damage coming from? And before you say "using higher ranks" you need to realize that you need mana regen to use higher ranks, not a higher mana pool.

You also link DPS meters of fights, but you aren't proving what gear they are wearing. I absolutely guarantee you all of those Ret Paladins are using gear according to stat weights very similar to mine. Their realmplayers is showing them in gear with high intellect and spell power for reduced AP and Melee Crit because those two stats are much more valuable in PvP than in PvE, and they are in PvP gear.

[smilkovpetko]

Again, your post has no math, it just says "35 Int gives 48 DPS to Consecration". Consecration doesn't scale with Int, so where is this increase in damage coming from? And before you say "using higher ranks" you need to realize that you need mana regen to use higher ranks, not a higher mana pool.

You also link DPS meters of fights, but you aren't proving what gear they are wearing. I absolutely guarantee you all of those Ret Paladins are using gear according to stat weights very similar to mine. Their realmplayers is showing them in gear with high intellect and spell power for reduced AP and Melee Crit because those two stats are much more valuable in PvP than in PvE, and they are in PvP gear.

Consecration doesn't scale with Int

35 Int = 1 full Consecration = 48 DPS over 8 seconds + Gained damage by Strength/Spell damage.

Without int gear you will have maximum 11 Consecrations , with Int gear you will have 20 Consecrations = 48 DPS 100% active time + the DPS increased by Str/SP

And before you say "using higher ranks" you need to realize that you need mana regen to use higher ranks,

You need mana , 17 k over 3 minutes. With Int you get this Numbers , without Int you are not even close.

You also link DPS meters of fights, but you aren't proving what gear they are wearing.

Boths use Paladin Sets = Intellect Gear.

[apocalypsa]

Int does not allow additional casts; it only allows higher ranks, and only once per fight. Assuming Consecration, you'll need 400 mana to uprank from 1 to 5, for 320 extra damage. 1 int is 12 mana assuming Divine Intellect and Kings.

Therefore, each point of int is 12 * (320 / 400) = 9.6 damage. Over a whole fight. Say the fight lasts 5 minutes... that's 0.032 dps.

Of course, upranking SoC or Exo will result in slightly more bang for your buck, and if you're aoeing, the damage increase from upranking Cons can be quite significant. However, this does not by any means mean that Int surpasses any other damage stat.

As paladins possess no way of regenerating a % of total mana, mana pool does not affect regen in any way.

[DrearyYew]

I'm 99% convinced he's just trolling at this point

and if he isn't I feel bad for whatever guild he is in

[smilkovpetko]

I'm 99% convinced he's just trolling at this point

and if he isn't I feel bad for whatever guild he is in

No wonder why Retri Paladin sucks , because we have clueless people who steal Warrior Gear which is not efficient , neither any good for our dps .

Especially preachers that deny at any cost Intellect as our DPS Stat.

[justclassic]

Int does not allow additional casts; it only allows higher ranks, and only once per fight. Assuming Consecration, you'll need 400 mana to uprank from 1 to 5, for 320 extra damage. 1 int is 12 mana assuming Divine Intellect and Kings.

Therefore, each point of int is 12 * (320 / 400) = 9.6 damage. Over a whole fight. Say the fight lasts 5 minutes... that's 0.032 dps.

Of course, upranking SoC or Exo will result in slightly more bang for your buck, and if you're aoeing, the damage increase from upranking Cons can be quite significant. However, this does not by any means mean that Int surpasses any other damage stat.

As paladins possess no way of regenerating a % of total mana, mana pool does not affect regen in any way.

Though 1 Int being 15 Mana (without any buffs or talents) the main-message of your post is completly correct.