Testing Server Access for all raiding guilds

[Plask]

I will refer to my post in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=2&t=13439&start=10

Just wanna tell my opinion regarding the players that get access to the testrealm. With a server that supports 8k players I think it wouldnt hurt to allow every raidguild to test the raidcontent. Right now several guilds are being shut out and the guilds with access does gain an unintended advantage when it comes to progression. Once BWL is released the guilds that ran it on the testrealm know what works and what doesn't. Just look at MC atm, it has some bugs which can cause wipes because the script isnt working properly.

I'll also refer to how it was in retail, where everyone could access the testrealm. However, I don't think its reasonable to allow every single player onto the testrealm but I atleast think it would be reasonable to allow every raiding guild to test out the content in order to promote a healthy competition among the guilds.

[Same]

In the initial test, 7 guilds were chosen from different parts of the community to test content. In all previous PTR realms, these guilds have done a great job helping the staff fix any bugs found in the tests. We want to provide great scripts for the entire community on the live realm, not create competition on the test realm, they are not exclusivley for raiding guilds, but for the entire community. The point of the test realm is to get the best content that we are able to, with the seven guilds selected, it is over 300 players testing which provides an adequate test for all content and keep ally players as professional as possible.

Same.

[Homer]

God I hate pathetic moderation and question dodging. How about you address the only part of his post that really mattered, that it gives other guilds a massive unfair advantage.

[Tempcore]

Blizzard let's everyone on the test realms because they have a huge competitive raiding community. If they had it their way they'd only have the top 5-10 guilds on there. It's much more efficient to test for bugs.
(Only the top guilds have direct contact with Blizzard when the raids go live, because they're the ones who find the bugs that stay in first)

Vanilla raids don't have too many mechanics you're missing out on anyway. If you say you're missing out on bugs you need to keep in mind to avoid wipes, there's a much easier solution for that: communication.
More communication coming from the tests to let us know if there are bugs that can't be fixed (for the time being).

As for the original topic: as i said above tests just run more efficient the way they do it now. 80% of the people that would join wouldn't find any bugs anyway, or even report them.

[Homer]

Your first sentence is pure speculation but apart from that the things you said are correct Temp, that does not change the fact that it is still a massive unfair advantage. Just because something is easier or more efficient does not make it right.

[Juflex]

Vanilla raids don't have too many mechanics you're missing out on anyway. If you say you're missing out on bugs you need to keep in mind to avoid wipes, there's a much easier solution for that: communication.

I would like to disagree with this statement. The raids from vanilla are the most complex ones and they need a good knowledge of the fight before you can discover any bugs.
A small screw up in the fight can wipe the entire raid and make it look like a bug.

This is one of the reasons which I think good raiding guilds can go and test the newly released or to be released content.

[nervous]

God I hate pathetic moderation and question dodging. How about you address the only part of his post that really mattered, that it gives other guilds a massive unfair advantage.

How exactly does it give guilds an unfair advantage? We take multiple hours doing multiple runs of instances trying every combination that could bug anything out, document it, spend hours looking up sources which corroborate our reports, to make the instance blizzlike. Your head would spin if you knew the effort involved by both the players and the developers.

If we do a good job reporting bugs, and we will, then the only advantage anyone would have would be that they got their raid to read up the strats on wowwiki an hour before the raid.

The real advantage is gained by the players that don't test it, as you don't have to waste all those man hours that are rewarded by scores of forum users frothing at the mouth that they can't test AV three weeks early even though they aren't even level 51 yet.

[Homer]

First I would like to say get of your high horse with the "my head would spin" crap. You're testing in a proverbiale wonderland compared to the things real testers endure, argumentum ad hominem is going to do nothing but discredit any real points you may have. Try testing 14 years ago in Pre-Alpha on Windows 98 your head would spin.

I am not sure if you're trolling or just being ignorant on purpose to try and further your point. Are you telling me you do not understand how extra time in a instance is an advantage? Not to mention the bugs that were not fixed and then I can only assume were abused with Molten Core.

Once again not sure if trolling or purposeful ignorance. You think reading a strategy an hour beforehand is an advantage but hundreds to thousands of hours inside said instance before other players is not?

Don't play the martyr son, you wanted to test it and it benefits you greatly. Also it makes no sense no one is yelling at you they are yelling at the actual Nostalrius team, you're trying to martyr for an issue your not involved in lol

[nervous]

First I would like to say get of your high horse with the "my head would spin" crap. You're testing in a proverbiale wonderland compared to the things real testers endure, argumentum ad hominem is going to do nothing but discredit any real points you may have. Try testing 14 years ago in Pre-Alpha on Windows 98 your head would spin.

Literally who cares about windows 98 pre-alpha.

I am not sure if you're trolling or just being ignorant on purpose to try and further your point. Are you telling me you do not understand how extra time in a instance is an advantage? Not to mention the bugs that were not fixed and then I can only assume were abused with Molten Core.

We didn't test Molten Core, and neither did any other guild as far as they'd like to have.

But yeah, I really don't think getting HOURS ON HOURS of practice watching the KTM threat meter in BWL isn't a big deal. Are you telling me that you fucking need hundreds of hours to learn how to stay below the 3rd and 4th brown box in your KTM threat meter to kill Vaelastrasz? Do you need 12 attempts to learn not to put curse of recklessness on Broodlord? Maybe you need help with basic instructions like "taunt the drake every time bigwigs tells you to" or "tranq every time frenzy comes up", but the vast majority of the raiding population isn't completely lobotomized, and has been raiding these instances fairly consistently for the past 2-3 years in some cases. Oh wait, I forgot how hard time lapse was. lols.

Once again not sure if trolling or purposeful ignorance. You think reading a strategy an hour beforehand is an advantage but hundreds to thousands of hours inside said instance before other players is not?

Everyone on this server going for server firsts has hundreds to thousands of hours inside BWL already. If you're not going for server firsts, why do you care?

Don't play the martyr son, you wanted to test it and it benefits you greatly. Also it makes no sense no one is yelling at you they are yelling at the actual Nostalrius team, you're trying to martyr for an issue your not involved in lol

I don't want to test it. I do want a good instance though. So I test, because I don't trust other people to make accurate reports because things like Drakk and Ragnaros being untauntable made it into the live realms because of some random report that wasn't sourced properly at all. And people are yelling at the guilds involved, maybe you should step up your forum trolling "SON"

[Homer]

If we do a good job reporting bugs, and we will, then the only advantage anyone would have would be that they got their raid to read up the strats on wowwiki an hour before the raid.

But yeah, I really don't think getting HOURS ON HOURS of practice watching the KTM threat meter in BWL isn't a big deal. Are you telling me that you fucking need hundreds of hours to learn how to stay below the 3rd and 4th brown box in your KTM threat meter to kill Vaelastrasz? Do you need 12 attempts to learn not to put curse of recklessness on Broodlord? Maybe you need help with basic instructions like "taunt the drake every time bigwigs tells you to" or "tranq every time frenzy comes up", but the vast majority of the raiding population isn't completely lobotomized, and has been raiding these instances fairly consistently for the past 2-3 years in some cases. Oh wait, I forgot how hard time lapse was. lols.

You stated reading a strategy guide an hour before a raid would help with following an add-on's instructions but not time in said instance with aforementioned add-on's.

Obvious troll is obvious, but can't you be a little more logical so I can occupy myself? R.I.P Intelligent trolls circa 2008