What's up with PvP Hit Cap on Nostalrius?

[Youfie]

Take a look at this video and there are TONS of examples of the EXTREMELY well known vanilla PVPer Vurtne hitting players 10+ Lvls higher almost every time and killing them. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=icWqS9af6uc (skip to 15:00)

interesting video. I don't have the time to look into it entirely, but just the very first fight :

16:52 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : resisted ;
16:59 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : landed ;
16:59 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Totem tick (not 100% sure) : resisted ;
17:05 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : landed ;
17:10 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Purge : landed ;
17:11 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : landed ;
17:11 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : resisted ;
17:23 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Totem tick : resisted ;
(Totem tick landed somewhere around here)
17:38 : Tazyr, "??" opponent : Totem tick : resisted ;
17:38 : Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : resisted ;

This sample is very small anyway so statistically speaking it isn't great, but you can see your point is far from obvious .

[Youfie]

I got my information not from any i-net source, i know it, coz i lived this game and debating about if there is a difference between hit chance vs a PvE and PvP target are more than obsolete. I have no source and no numbers about how EXACTLY the chances should be but questioning if there even was a difference feels like a big joke to me.

Nobody questions if there was a difference. We all agree about that. And there IS a difference currently on Nostalrius buddy. We're just trying to figure out this difference in itself : how much was it?

And actually trying to figure it out is kinda silly cause Blizzard, in a blue post, published the exact formula.

[Hawksworth]

"Dozens of reliable sources about the 1% miss chance no matter what in PvE can be found (such as this Elitist Jerks thread from around december 2006, among many other) .

I was saying I don't remember anything specifically ironically, meaning the person I was quoting shouldn't rely on his sole memories from 10 years ago .

Regarding the 1% miss in PvP, it might not exist indeed, haven't looked into it personally ."

Does linking another thread constitute hard proof? I don't think it does and for someone who is very keen on reliable sources I'm a bit surprised you did. I would like a concrete source on this.

Also you stated you don't remember anything specifically and ten year old memories should not be relied upon but this is exactly what you did in regard to the 1% miss chance in pvp. As stated you hadn't even looked into it personally.

Live by the sword, die by the sword

It's true that the 1% miss chance is getting off topic but it does highlight the problems with looking for concrete proof from ten years ago.

[Youfie]

"Dozens of reliable sources about the 1% miss chance no matter what in PvE can be found (such as this Elitist Jerks thread from around december 2006, among many other) .

I was saying I don't remember anything specifically ironically, meaning the person I was quoting shouldn't rely on his sole memories from 10 years ago .

Regarding the 1% miss in PvP, it might not exist indeed, haven't looked into it personally ."

Does linking another thread constitute hard proof? I don't think it does and for someone who is very keen on reliable sources I'm a bit surprised you did. I would like a concrete source on this.

Also you stated you don't remember anything specifically and tem year old memories should not be relied upon but this is exactly what you did in regard to the !5 miss chance in pvp. As stated you hadn't even looked into it personally.

Live by the sword, die by the swords:)

It's true that the 1% miss chance is getting off topic but it does highlight the problems with looking for concrete proof from ten years ago.

I think these numbers were obtained through combatlog data parsing on a large scale, so they're pretty safe. Specific threads about this might exist.

Buddy, if the most trusted members of the EJ forums from back in the days aren't trustworthy enough for you, indeed nothing will .

[Polio]

Take a look at this video and there are TONS of examples of the EXTREMELY well known vanilla PVPer Vurtne hitting players 10+ Lvls higher almost every time and killing them. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=icWqS9af6uc (skip to 15:00)

interesting video. I don't have the time to look into it entirely, but just the very first fight :

16:52 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : resisted ;
16:59 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : landed ;
16:59 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Totem tick (not 100% sure) : resisted ;
17:05 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : landed ;
17:10 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Purge : landed ;
17:11 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : landed ;
17:11 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : resisted ;
17:23 - Tazyr, "??" opponent : Totem tick : resisted ;
(Totem tick landed somewhere around here)
17:38 : Tazyr, "??" opponent : Totem tick : resisted ;
17:38 : Tazyr, "??" opponent : Earth Shock : resisted ;

This sample is very small anyway so statistically speaking it isn't great, but you can see your point is far from obvious .

Fair enough, Youfie. However, I now see that judging this based on an unreadable level is futile. If you watch at 19:00 he fights a Mage and a Priest 5 levels ahead (red) and was only resisted once in the 5 minutes of fighting. It should also be noted that we don't known how much +hit he has on his gear or from talents. Would a level 36 horde like to meet me tonight in Arathi or Hillsbrad so I can record the data for comparison? (6pm EST)

[Hawksworth]

"Dozens of reliable sources about the 1% miss chance no matter what in PvE can be found (such as this Elitist Jerks thread from around december 2006, among many other) .

I was saying I don't remember anything specifically ironically, meaning the person I was quoting shouldn't rely on his sole memories from 10 years ago .

Regarding the 1% miss in PvP, it might not exist indeed, haven't looked into it personally ."

Does linking another thread constitute hard proof? I don't think it does and for someone who is very keen on reliable sources I'm a bit surprised you did. I would like a concrete source on this.

Also you stated you don't remember anything specifically and tem year old memories should not be relied upon but this is exactly what you did in regard to the !5 miss chance in pvp. As stated you hadn't even looked into it personally.

Live by the sword, die by the swords:)

It's true that the 1% miss chance is getting off topic but it does highlight the problems with looking for concrete proof from ten years ago.

I think these numbers were obtained through combatlog data parsing on a large scale, so they're pretty safe. Specific threads about this might exist.

Buddy, if the most trusted members of the EJ forums from back in the days aren't trustworthy enough for you, indeed nothing will .

I'm sure elitist jerks are far more knowledgeable than I am or care to be.

However the point is that you have demanded solid proof of other peoples claims throughout this thread yet when it came to your own you also failed to provide anything concrete

Anyway, I guess we can go on like this forever. Essentially there is something amiss in pvp but nothing can be done about it because of the lack of proof.

[Polio]

Anyway, I guess we can go on like this forever. Essentially there is something amiss in pvp but nothing can be done about it because of the lack of proof.

Only there IS something can be done about it. Everyone knows something is up, so it will be fixed regardless. You forget that we have the best developers of any private server who have much more information at their disposal than any of us. They've been doing this for a long, long time, so I'm sure they have much better methods of finding out these numbers. I suppose the only thing they need now is a big enough outcry from the players.

[Shido]

I do find this strange, but Polio is making sense. Even with regular mobs 3-4 levels below me my Gnome Warrior does occasionally resist spells entirely.

When I received (THE UNBREAKABLE) Orc Crusher, I wanted to raise my 'Two-Handed Mace' weapon skill as soon as possible because I didn't want to constantly miss players during combat. However; at level 24 I fought a level 21 shaman with 42 weapon skill with little to no 'Miss'.

Now I know for a fact, against a regular level 21 mob, I would frequently miss at 42 weapon skill. Why? Because that's just how it is, I don't need an explanation. I was missing against a level 4 mob when I first used (THE UNHOLY) Orc Crusher and constantly missed.

But alas, it just comes down to me saying from experience!

Oh by the way, I'm sure this is on everyone's mind; Youfie, stop being a pretentious jackass and actually contribute your experiences or knowledge based on OP's topic instead of going 'off' topic, irritating everyone, and hindering a possible solution.

And remember; let's positive thinking!

[CapnPrat]

Vividly remember being able to kill players 8-10 levels higher than me if they were awful on my warlock in vanilla. Also vividly remember groups of lowbies being able to gang up on higher levels without all of them having to be melee.

I've had moonfires, roots, and faerie fires completely resisted at 60 on extremely rare occasions by level 20-40 players, while leveling I had absolutely no chance to root or land anything on someone orange +, which I understand is intended in some sense but it just seems off.

I don't have the math to back any of this I don't know if there was a default 1% chance to resist (don't remember that being implemented in pvp), but pvp spell hit rating does seem funky.

I've killed people 10-15 levels up on me multiple multiple times. I've also been hit by players 10-20 levels down from me, both with melee and spells. I most certainly resist them more than I would someone my level, but that has always been the case since I've been playing this game.

[Polio]

(THE UNBREAKABLE) Orc Crusher,

[color=#FF8000]Orc Crusher, the Malice!
Shido-ne weaboo-ne

I've killed people 10-15 levels up on me multiple multiple times. I've also been hit by players 10-20 levels down from me, both with melee and spells. I most certainly resist them more than I would someone my level, but that has always been the case since I've been playing this game.

You seem to be an exception to what's happening to everyone else. Are you speaking of here on Nost, or your retail experience?