Unorthodox specs accepted?

[Larsen]

The thing is, why should a guild recruit one of those weak specs? It's not that the raid is impossible without a min-maxed setup, but there's no reason to make it harder for yourself and encourage sub-optimal choices from players. It's like there's this entitled sense of indignation from people who can't accept that some specs are simply so poor that a raid has no real reason to bring them.

Sometimes, a cool guy wants to play such a spec and the guild will allow it. That's why most guilds do end up with a few of them. When it comes to recruiting strangers, a guild has no obligation or reason to favor players who willingly choose the worst specs in the game. Do you expect them to go "well, the game is 10 years old, let's make no effort to do our best and just make a raid out of the first 40 people who ask to join"?

Don't choose the weakest spec unless you're prepared to accept that some people won't indulge you.

[Orthodoxy]

The thing is, why should a guild recruit one of those weak specs? It's not that the raid is impossible without a min-maxed setup, but there's no reason to make it harder for yourself and encourage sub-optimal choices from players. It's like there's this entitled sense of indignation from people who can't accept that some specs are simply so poor that a raid has no real reason to bring them.

Sometimes, a cool guy wants to play such a spec and the guild will allow it. That's why most guilds do end up with a few of them. When it comes to recruiting strangers, a guild has no obligation or reason to favor players who willingly choose the worst specs in the game. Do you expect them to go "well, the game is 10 years old, let's make no effort to do our best and just make a raid out of the first 40 people who ask to join"?

Don't choose the weakest spec unless you're prepared to accept that some people won't indulge you.

Thank you

[bdan]

This thread is funny. Brining in hybrids is pretty stupid. This is going to be a full server. There will be tons of players who know how to play and will be playing the right spec for raiding. It will be easy to find mages/rogues/warlocks who know what they are doing and are specced correctly. Assuming I have to settle for a hybrid because for some bizarre reason I cant get enough good players, I would give them gear only after every other pure was geared first. Im sure ill have at least a few good rogues/mages/warlocks. They will be in full epics before an enhancement shaman or balance druid gets any sort of rings/staves or other gear that they share.

Why give a good enhancement shaman gear if a good rogue can use it? The good rogue will be doing more damage than the good enhancement shaman with that gear upgrade.

[Orthodoxy]

This thread is funny. Brining in hybrids is pretty stupid. This is going to be a full server. There will be tons of players who know how to play and will be playing the right spec for raiding. It will be easy to find mages/rogues/warlocks who know what they are doing and are specced correctly. Assuming I have to settle for a hybrid because for some bizarre reason I cant get enough good players, I would give them gear only after every other pure was geared first. Im sure ill have at least a few good rogues/mages/warlocks. They will be in full epics before an enhancement shaman or balance druid gets any sort of rings/staves or other gear that they share.

Why give a good enhancement shaman gear if a good rogue can use it? The good rogue will be doing more damage than the good enhancement shaman with that gear upgrade.

Because of course the enhancement shaman will be more "skilled" at mashing 3 buttons because he marches to the beat of his own drum.

[bdan]

Because of course the enhancement shaman will be more "skilled" at mashing 3 buttons because he marches to the beat of his own drum.

Hahah of course. "well that shaman is probably really good and he will make up for his spec with this extreme skill. the rogue probably sucks anyways." Rogue hits 3 buttons, shaman hits his 3 buttons. no skill involved except getting out of fire. Obviously rogue will win.

Especially with mages and locks. Mages spam frostbolt, locks spam shadowbolt. But "hurrr durrr I wanna play fire in mc or demo cause demons are awesome! you shld totally bring me ill make up with it in skill even though the correct spec only needs to spam one button to win and there is no way in hell I will beat them"

[Haifischy]

This is MMO, but it is also a RPG. 10 years old one. Instead of looking for some challenge, you guys are min-maxing for an easy kill.

If I was a GM, I wouldn't mind to let some guys roll with whatever spec they like. Hybrid classes are not excelling at anything, but they bring diversity. For 10yo content, I think diversity is always better than min-maxing your raid setup (unless you go for server firsts, topkek).

You can always let an enha shaman in your raid, as long as he has a second properly geared resto set + consumables for both specs.
You can always let a retri pala, as long as he has a second properly geared holy/prot set + consumables for both specs.
You can always bring a moonkin, as long as he has a second properly geared feral/resto set + consumables for both specs.
This will also show you how dedicated that guy is, if he is ready to put effort into grinding two enchanted sets of gear and two sets of consumables per raid, then he is a fucking treasure, no matter what he is playing...


Then, boom, one of your healer/tank goes offline cuz his cat drowned in the sink (I've heard that once), you can either spend 10-15 min waiting for one of your other healers to come online, you can grab one random guy, or you can just tell one of your hybrids to put on their offspec gear and heal. Yeah, he will probably heal for 2/3 of the lowest proper healer in the raid, but you can squeeze a try or a kill while you are waiting.

Answers to possible questions/arguments:
1 / No, hybrid classes won't be top dps/tank
2 / Yes, it is worth to have one dedicated hybrid over one slacker rogue
3 / No, you are not wasting a spot in the raid that way

[Theloras]

You guys are getting all /emo and /serious about a 10 year old video game that people want to play for their own enjoyment.

It's a game.
People want to try different things or a new challenge.
Get over it.

[bdan]

You guys are getting all /emo and /serious about a 10 year old video game that people want to play for their own enjoyment.

It's a game.
People want to try different things or a new challenge.
Get over it.

That's great. try different things in the new guild that you create. The question was whether or not unorthodox specs were accepted. The answer is no for the most part. Yes there are exceptions, but in general, you will not be raiding as a shadowpriest or moonkin. People listed reasons why. You seem to be getting " all /emo and /serious" about playing a non recommended spec.

[Bad Acid]

This whole thread doesn't make too much sense. I don't see what the problem is, you want to raid with unorthodox build? No problem with me, but if you can't find a good guild willing to accept you, don't waste energy trying to convince them or insulting them for "not respecting your choice" because that way you don't respect their choice either.

Honestly, just make your own goddamn guild, it's not that hard and it solves all your problems.

[Magnifican]

This thread is funny. Brining in hybrids is pretty stupid. This is going to be a full server. There will be tons of players who know how to play and will be playing the right spec for raiding. It will be easy to find mages/rogues/warlocks who know what they are doing and are specced correctly.

"Right" spec, specced "correctly"... lol the narrowmindedness. What about playing something that you find the most fun? Why force people to do something that they dont want because you want to clear the raid "faster"? I mean, that is what this whole thing is about really. Mixmax for server first etc is cool and all, but for people like me, aka filthy casuals, playing this game is suppose to be fun with people you enjoy playing with, and I find the most fun class to play shadowpriest for example, micromanage the mana, having Mind blast and SW:P in between mindflay spam is alot more fun that shadowbolt spam at least, and I dont mind buffing my fellow locks to have even more powwaah! I could just roll lock but I find the two specs boring and unless you get to throw Corruption you basically sit on SB spam the whole raid, its too boring imo.

Since you CAN clear the raids without much trouble even if you bring shadowpriest, enh sham, ele sham, ferals and even one oomkin and ret pally, while the rest are pure dps and whatnot. Why not? If people enjoy it the raiddps might be alittle less but in the end all have fun playing the way they like. Btw I saw some video of a shadowpriest being on 5th spot in the dps in AQ - that was pretty neat considering there's 40 people there, but I dont care about dps much and he was ofc also buffing locks dps who was even higher on that list.

This is not the same thing as standing around in fire or semi-afk during bossfights like so many do regardless of spec, or dies over and over on the same thing, because that is lack of effort, disinterest and what I would consider real selfishness and trolling if intended. If a person is skilled and doesnt cause any problems for the raid, bringing unique buffs etc, helps offheal/offtank or whatnot, what does it matter if he does slightly less dps?

It almost sounds like you narrowminded elitists would seriously rather take 39 players to a raid than to bring that hybrid player? Because of sheer hostility towards the spec he choose, or so you dont have to risk loosing precious loot to said hybrid. Its kinda sad tbh.

Thankfully alot of people dont agree with you!

You will not make it into the raids of any halfway decent guild as a shadow priest with the current 8 debuff limit, unless the GM is your best friend or something and they feel like carrying you. It literally makes no sense to bring you over a Mage, Mage is easy to be decent at, and they are all over this server. Also, you will be competing for gear with classes that will pull 2x your dps, which will make you very unpopular. Just the straight truth.

I appreciate the input. First of all im not interested in hardcore raiding, but somewhat casual raiding. Since alot of guilds on retail did clear MC, Ony, BWL raids pre 1.7 with shadowpriests in there its obviously possible, albeit "less effective" than bringin another mage/lock. The boss might die a couple of seconds later and that apparently matters alot (most of the time it wont hit the enrage timer though).
Also the question was whether or not to bother picking Shadow Weaving or not, which is the debuff that's considered "forbidden" with 8 slots. I'd appreciate someone with knowledge from guilds that actually had shadowpriests in them, not your "dont come at all" statement which isnt helping much. From the pages past I already know what you think about hybrids Ortodoxy, and I will bring them anyway, because they are FUN to play, so if you dont have anything helpful or constructive to say about playing hybrid then why bother answer.

You guys are getting all /emo and /serious about a 10 year old video game that people want to play for their own enjoyment.

It's a game.
People want to try different things or a new challenge.
Get over it.

Thank you!

That's great. try different things in the new guild that you create.

Honestly, just make your own goddamn guild, it's not that hard and it solves all your problems.

Lol. why should everyone that plays the odd spec have to create a new guild? That'd be alot of guilds. People could just be allowed to search and talk openly about wanting to join a guild without being harrassed and insulted by elitists like some people here, of course that doesnt mean that a guild has to allow you in, but thats not the issue, the issue is every knowitallomgsohardcore person constantly gotta tell people they cant play the class they enjoy or that they are being selfish for doing so. Thats just sad