TBC vs. Vanilla

[PeaceHammer]

As I've said before, Vanilla is the only WoW for me.

A few reasons why I don't like TBC:

- Flying Mounts (one of the worst things ever added to WoW)
- Resilience (I liked being able to use PvE gear in PvP)
- Arena (where Vanilla is world PvP and a lot of large scale BG's, I can't get excited about arenas. And yet TBC forces you into them to get PvP gear)

[Aesorn]

As I've said before, Vanilla is the only WoW for me.

A few reasons why I don't like TBC:

- Flying Mounts (one of the worst things ever added to WoW)
- Resilience (I liked being able to use PvE gear in PvP)
- Arena (where Vanilla is world PvP and a lot of large scale BG's, I can't get excited about arenas. And yet TBC forces you into them to get PvP gear)

You do know PvE gear is still a thing in TBC arena's right? Every top player mixes a good amount of PvE gear with PvP gear in TBC because you dont need 500 resil.... Also vanilla had more world pvp but even in retail you can still find people world pvping today in Outlands because some of those pvp hubs in each zone actually encouraged and caused lots of world pvp at all times of the day. Also yeah Wpvp and oldschool AV is fun but come on bro the skill gap is a fucking joke comparing arena's to Wpvp. Casual pvp may be fun to most people but people who actually want to outplay people with skill / tactics/ and coordination play arena's.

[Dr. Doom]

As I've said before, Vanilla is the only WoW for me.

A few reasons why I don't like TBC:

- Flying Mounts (one of the worst things ever added to WoW)
- Resilience (I liked being able to use PvE gear in PvP)
- Arena (where Vanilla is world PvP and a lot of large scale BG's, I can't get excited about arenas. And yet TBC forces you into them to get PvP gear)

You do know PvE gear is still a thing in TBC arena's right? Every top player mixes a good amount of PvE gear with PvP gear in TBC because you dont need 500 resil.... Also vanilla had more world pvp but even in retail you can still find people world pvping today in Outlands because some of those pvp hubs in each zone actually encouraged and caused lots of world pvp at all times of the day. Also yeah Wpvp and oldschool AV is fun but come on bro the skill gap is a fucking joke comparing arena's to Wpvp. Casual pvp may be fun to most people but people who actually want to outplay people with skill / tactics/ and coordination play arena's.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/13/bliz ... a-mistake/
From Pardo just after he left his position in WoW.

[PeaceHammer]

As I've said before, Vanilla is the only WoW for me.

A few reasons why I don't like TBC:

- Flying Mounts (one of the worst things ever added to WoW)
- Resilience (I liked being able to use PvE gear in PvP)
- Arena (where Vanilla is world PvP and a lot of large scale BG's, I can't get excited about arenas. And yet TBC forces you into them to get PvP gear)

You do know PvE gear is still a thing in TBC arena's right? Every top player mixes a good amount of PvE gear with PvP gear in TBC because you dont need 500 resil.... Also vanilla had more world pvp but even in retail you can still find people world pvping today in Outlands because some of those pvp hubs in each zone actually encouraged and caused lots of world pvp at all times of the day. Also yeah Wpvp and oldschool AV is fun but come on bro the skill gap is a fucking joke comparing arena's to Wpvp. Casual pvp may be fun to most people but people who actually want to outplay people with skill / tactics/ and coordination play arena's.

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/13/bliz ... a-mistake/
From Pardo just after he left his position in WoW.

Good read.

I know some people are big fans of arena, but I can't stand it. Small scale PvP bores the hell out of me. Give me the chaos of world PvP and some epic AV battles.

[Aesorn]

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/13/bliz ... a-mistake/
From Pardo just after he left his position in WoW.

haha what some Blizzard dev said really shouldn't mean a damn thing considering they are the reason we can't have nice things anyway and why the game is so trash now so obviously they have been wrong in most things they added to the game overtime. Though the amount of skill arena's takes compared to Wpvp / BG's is laughable, I have seen so many Wpvp and BG heroes attempt arena's and get reckt because they never learned how to actually do real WoW pvp. You know the type of pvp that actually takes skill and is competitive.... Arena's is the only thing we have in this game to show who is actually good at this game compared to other players that do BG's all day and suck. Walking around in full season 4 gear back in retail looking at all the people who were in half the armor because they weren't good enough to get rating for all the pieces is how the game should be. The better players deserve better rewards, that's how games should work but I know you casual pvpers won't agree cause well... you aren't good enough to enjoy arena's to their potential, sorry.

[Dr. Doom]

http://www.engadget.com/2009/11/13/bliz ... a-mistake/
From Pardo just after he left his position in WoW.

haha what some Blizzard dev said really shouldn't mean a damn thing.

This is Rob Pardo. Not a Blizzard dev anymore.
The person that designed WoW from Classic to early Wotlk alongside Jeffrey Kaplan. People who played Everquest, were guild leaders in there and were recruited for their commitment to challenging endgame content. Classic WoW was EQ with the punishment stripped.

you casual pvpers won't agree cause well... you aren't good enough to enjoy arena's to their potential, sorry.

When I played PvP I could sometimes dedicate 6 hours a day to it. I never played WoW casually although I should have.
Now that I don't play WoW anymore I just comment here since I appreciate the time I had in the game. Not to argue about 'skill' when it comes to social placebo.

[Hernia]

There is no skill in MMO pvp, sorry. It's completely dependent on your gear and always has been lol. If you want esports go play dota or some shit.

I wouldnt go so far as to say arenas were a mistake, they were a fun diversion. Killing world pvp was the critical error

Also lol @ the kiddie discrediting Rob Fuckin' Pardo.

[Dr. Doom]

Kind of an insult to sports to equate them with this kind of thingie. eSports, lol.

[Dacien]

I understand the discussion when it comes to good/bad features and whatnot, but it leads to another question...

I'm assuming Legacy servers would be the original "blizzlike" forms - the good with the bad. I wouldn't want them to re-imagine any of the expansions - just give me what they gave us the first go around. I enjoyed it all the way through WoTLK.

Am I the only one that thinks of Legacy (Vanilla, TBC, and WoTLK) in that way?

Sure, just no need for wotlk. A casualfest expansion that ended in ICC mania, with all previous raids rendered useless.

There's a very real problem with the TBC nerfs though. Starting from 2.1 and all the way till the end, nerfing heroics and raids was regular business. Magtheridon's Lair being the saddest case of the bunch, but practically every raid getting affected. Legacy servers should really reverse this, since the expac will not move on, and there's no reason to speed people's progress.

I don't see any reason, given another go at the past, not to rectify missteps like nerfs. Like trivializing content. If the legacy movement blows wide open at Blizzard, I'd like to see untouched Vanilla servers, but I'd also like to see modified servers that eschew trivializing patches, nerfing patches, etc. Heck, we could go all the way to ICC "Classic Style" if we get rid of heirlooms, LFD, nerfs, and the like along the way.

[Xaverius]

From Pardo just after he left his position in WoW.

Pardo did what now? I had no idea about this. No wonder wow is crap when most of the big names are gone.

Small scale PvP bores the hell out of me. Give me the chaos of world PvP and some epic AV battles.

This is why I liked the PvP in TESO. Fighting over Cyrodiil's forts with dozens and dozens of people everywhere and using siege engines, man that was great. First time since 2009 that I enjoyed pvp.